Germania-Argentina

[wickedsick]

E' un'analisi semplicistica, banale e che fonda le sue ragioni sull'interismo. Maradona è visto male da tutti gli interisti del forum semplicemente perchè non ha convocato Cambiasso e non ha fatto giocare Milito.
La verità, fatti alla mano, è che l'Argentina da buona squadra sudamericana gioca in un certo modo, così come fa il Brasile, anche se quest'ultimo è stato un po' più "europizzato" da Dunga. Nel momento in cui vengono a mancare i singoli la squadra brancola nel buio, con questo sistema a volte si vince e a volte si perde, se poi succede, come è successo, che la scarsa vena dei singoli coincida con una partita tatticamente perfetta dell'avversario, oltretutto più forte, allora magari si becca il 4 a 0. Le squadre europee hanno un tipo di storia, quelle sudamericane un'altra.
In un mondiale opaco come questo, dove non so bene per quale motivo tutti i grandi nomi sono venuti a mancare con prestazioni incolori, è perfettamente normale che ci ritroviamo in semifinale già due squadre solide europee e una probabile terza, Wang permettendo.
Non ha fallito Maradona, anche se a voi fa piacere crederlo.

1) A me Maradona sta simpatico. Non ha convocato Cambiasso e Zanetti, ok. Son scelte. Mica mi sta antipatico perchè non chiama Cambiasso anzi son contento, perchè cambiasso non regge troppe partite.
Il problema è che se non convochi quella gente devi portare gente adatta.
Errori:
a) Non porti uno come cambiasso? ok non porti nemmeno veron che in campo cammina e non fa altro. Porti un altro mediano dalle caratteristiche di cambiasso e non dirmi bolatti perchè è ridicolo e Mascherano non ha saltato una partita solo per culo e sviste arbitrali. Tutta la squadra faceva perno su mascherano. Se usciva lui o si infortunava?
I laterali e qui ha perso il mondiale maradona. Heinze e Jonas e Otamendi... ma che ***** è? Son terzini?
Discorso su di maria... E' un'ala da 442 stop.
Ti rendi conto che messi per avere palla doveva stare dietro il proprio centrocampo e farsela passare da mascherano?
Capitolo tevez. Bravo nulla da dire... ma è possibile giocare con higuain (che non torna) messi e tevez (torna solo il primo tempo poi il secondo si spompa...) e avere anche di maria e solo mascherano/maxi a centrocampo? Bah. Per me l'argentina non aveva un'identità. Ha sbloccato le partite prevalentemente con azioni fortunose. La scelta dei terzini è stata condizionante. Maradona pensava di lasciare tutto a messi e company ma alla fine la squadra era spaccata. 4 giocatori dietro, mascherano davanti e le praterie a centrocampo.
Al primo avversario organizzato le ha prese giustamente. La germania, come l'olanda, come lo stesso brasile se concedi le ripartenze (come anche l'inter) ti fottono, c'è poco da fare. Contro le piccole vinci perchè la gente come higuain messi tevez e di maria li surclassa tecnicamente ma contro le squadre veramente preparate perdi sempre se non hai un briciolo di squadra e quest'anno l'argentina potenzialmente poteva vincere tutto.

[KoroshiyaIchi]

Infatti su El Carin non stanno già massacrando maradona...

Che strano, un giornale nazionale che parla male del tecnico che è uscito dal mondiale.
Roba mai vista. Deve essere colpa di Maradona, altrimenti gli avrebbero battuto le mani come hanno fatto con gli altri tecnici eliminati.

@Macca, hai finito con le banalità?

[wickedsick]

Cosa che accade un po' ovunque, solo su questo forum stanno dando tutta questa importanza alla sconfitta dell'Argentina per dimostrare qualche teoria blanda e terra terra, tutto il resto del mondo calcistico tesse le lodi di una grande Germania, come è giusto che sia.

Il surplus della germania non è dato dai singoli. Perchè son tutti inferiori agli argentini. (a parte i terzini...)

@Macca, hai finito con le banalità?

certo son banalità.

[fantasmaomicida]

Il surplus della germania non è dato dai singoli. Perchè son tutti inferiori agli argentini. (a parte i terzini...)

I portieri a nefandezze se la giocano eh.....

[KoroshiyaIchi]

Mi spieghi come hai fatto? Mi hai dato ragione nel primo quote che poi contraddiceva il secondo, dai, fai il serio, organizzati prima almeno.

[wickedsick]

Mi spieghi come hai fatto? Mi hai dato ragione nel primo quote che poi contraddiceva il secondo, dai, fai il serio, organizzati prima almeno.

Germany 4-0 Argentina: Germany are getting better and better and better
July 3, 2010

The starting line-ups

Germany put in one of the most impressive performances in recent World Cup history to absolutely thrash Diego Maradona’s Argentina side.

No surprises in terms of line-ups – they were as predicted in the preview, and Argentina remained with their loose 4-4-2 diamond shape.

Right from the first minute Argentina were overrun in the midfield. Bastian Schweinsteiger picked up Lionel Messi, giving Sami Khedira license to get forward and support Mesut Oezil. With he picked up by Javier Mascherano, Germany were sweeping forward in numbers and overawing the Argentine central midfield.

It quickly became apparent the Argentina were only ever defending with seven players, against a Germany side that features attacking threats from all over the pitch. This is not rare in modern football, especially with the popularity of the 4-3-3 formation – but in that system, the wingers pin back the full-backs and prevent them from joining the attack.

That didn’t happen with Argentina, as Lionel Messi, Carlos Tevez and Gonzalo Higuain all stayed in central positions when Argentina didn’t have the ball. Not only did this mean Germany were able to get their full-backs forward with ease, it also meant that out-balls became more difficult when Argentina won back possession.

The main beneficiary of the lack of defensive work from Argentina’s attacking trio was Philip Lahm. He constantly motored down the right flank, taking advantage of Thomas Mueller’s intentions to make central runs in behind the defence. On more than one occasion, he found himself with a huge 20-yard strip of pitch to himself on the right, and was constantly an attacking option when Argentina shut down the first phase of attacks.

Argentina midfield outnumbered

Argentina’s three central midfielders simply had too much work to do. The carrilero closest to the ball when Germany attacked down the flank came out wide, and the other was had to tuck in and form a traditional central midfield ‘two’ alongside Mascherano. But this left Argentina with no-one on the opposite side of the midfield, and the Argentine three were forced to constantly shuffle across the pitch as Germany worked the ball from side to side. Again, Lahm loved this, having 30 yards of space to pick up speed and run at Gabriel Heinze – and there was only one winner there. We should also remember, of course, that neither Angel di Maria nor Maxi Rodriguez are defensive-minded players – both prefer to play on the wing, and whilst both are honest, hard-working players, Argentina needed more than that to break down the constant German attacks.

A knock-on effect of Tevez and Messi doing little defensively (and the midfielders being overrun with runs from Ozil and Khedira) was that there was very little pressure on the ball when Germany had it in deep positions. Schweinsteiger had all the time he liked to pick out a key pass from the centre of midfield, and though his distribution was often slightly wayward – he only completed 52 of 84 passes – part of the reason for this stat is that he was always looking to play the killer ball, because he had enough time and space to attempt ambitious passes rather than simple balls backwards.

Germany defend superbly

Germany were the complete opposite defensively. Their wide players dropped deep to form two banks of four when they didn’t have the ball, with Oezil given a free role. They sat relatively deep and relatively narrow, and whilst Mueller and Lukas Podolski were disciplined, they had relatively little work to do going towards their own goal, because Heinze and Nicolas Otamendi rarely got forward, and were slow when they did.

Hence, it was generally five Argentina players attacking against eight Germans, in two solid lines. They had little width high up the pitch, whilst Tevez and Messi operated too close together. Messi increasingly dropped deeper and deeper to pick up possession, summing up his frustration at a lack of service. Such is the love for knee-jerk reactions and an obsession with using the phrase ‘big game bottler’, Messi will probably be blamed for putting in a poor performance in this game, but he actually did rather well. He weaved in and out of challenges and played some genuinely excellent passes (that weren’t forthcoming from Argentina’s midfielders), but he was simply being forced to play too deep, with Tevez eating up the space he wanted to occupy.

The German midfield pressed well throughout the game, and the two central players dealt with Messi excellently when he moved forward – passing him from zone to zone and largely leaving Tevez to the centre-backs. Khedira and Schweinsteiger always made sure that whichever was not picking up Messi was always in a good position to sweep up ahead of the defence, and this increasingly forced Messi deeper and deeper.

Easy goals

The first goal came early on from a Schweinsteiger free-kick that wasn’t defended properly, and Mueller headed in from close range. Germany dominated the rest of the half, and there was little sign of any tactical changes from Maradona and Bilardo. The one thing they did was to switch di Maria and Rodriguez, but that just gives a chance to use the phrase ‘rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic’ more appropriately than ever. Argentina’s shape was awful, just lacking any cohesion whatsoever, and offered no variation in build-up play.

There’s little point in describing the three second-half goals in detail, because they were all exactly the same. Overload Argentina in their right-back zone, shift a centre-back out of position to open up space in the defence, cross for a player on the edge of the six-yard box to score. Podolski for Klose, Schweinsteiger for Freidrich, Ozil for Klose. It didn’t matter who the German players were, they all had the determination to get into attacking zones, they all had the intelligence to look up and play a simple square ball, they all had the technical quality to play the crosses and finishes to perfection.

Simplicity the key

And in a sense, it was the most beautifully simple display of football you’ll ever see, both in terms of the tactical plan and the performance on the pitch. There was no bold strategic shock from Joachim Loew, there were no 30-yard thunderbolts to remember for years. It was just pass and move, fluidity and good teamwork, and the basic plan to get the ball into wide areas, then play the ball across the box. The similarity of the three second half goals is so strong it borders on the ridiculous – the only surprise is that they all came from the side of the pitch that Lahm wasn’t on.

The final twenty minutes saw Argentina try and fit Messi, Tevez, Higuain, Pastore and Aguero into the same team. There was so little element of ‘tactics’ to it that it barely deserves talking about, it was just ‘throw on your best attackers’. Juan Veron would have been appropriate to play some key passes and let Messi work further up the pitch, but it wouldn’t have altered Germany’s cruise to victory.

Conclusion

A victory in every single part of the pitch for Germany, who showed the value of cohesive attacking play and defensive organisation. 4-0 is simply a score that doesn’t happen in quarter-finals of World Cups – not between two first-rate footballing nations. Usually, a side gets to 2-0 or even 3-0 and closes the game out – often with the next game in mind. Germany, however, didn’t have to worry about that because they barely needed to work hard to score – they did it wit h a minimum of fuss. It may be a new-look, exciting German side, but they retain the professionalism and efficiency of old.

Argentina are out in the way many expected with Maradona as manager. Early on in this tournament he seemed to be proving his doubters wrong by playing a solid team that worked well together, but everything fell apart in dramatic circumstances here today. No organisation in defence, not enough numbers in midfield, no cohesion in attack. This defeat will take a long, long time for Argentina to get over.

[KoroshiyaIchi]

Macca se avessi scrittoi direttamente che avevo ragione ti saresti risparmiato di leggere tutte quelle righe.

[wickedsick]

hai ragione

[Apocalisse91]

L'importante è autoconvincersi.

[wickedsick]

Mi piacerebbe vedere Maradona allenare la roma.

[Apocalisse91]

Non ti piacerebbe in verità perchè sarebbe la fine dell'Inter.

[Quester_Wallace]

Vorrei far notare la mia firma.

[Wakosmog]

Vorrei far notare la mia firma.

Già fatto

[KoroshiyaIchi]

Germany put in one of the most impressive performances in recent World Cup history to absolutely thrash Diego Maradona’s Argentina side.

La Germania ha dato vita ad una delle più grandi prove nella storia recente della Coppa del Mondo per spazzare via l'Argentina di Diego Maradona.

No, ma è colpa di Diego, lo dice chiaramente qui:

And in a sense, it was the most beautifully simple display of football you’ll ever see, both in terms of the tactical plan and the performance on the pitch.

In pratica, è stata la più bella dimostrazione di calcio che vi capiterà mai di vedere, sia in termini di tattica che di perfomance.


Quanto sono stato stupido a dire che l'Argentina è uscita perchè ha incontrato una squadra più forte.

[xvaso]

Quanto sono stato stupido a dire che l'Argentina è uscita perchè ha incontrato una squadra più forte.

tu hai detto che maradona è un bravo allenatore

nn rigirarti la frittata come ti pare